Oh god here we go with people making the BS argument “I don’t tip to help end tipping culture” or, my personal favorite, “If I don’t tip them they’ll find another job when they don’t make enough money.”
The other side if that is why should I tip you for putting cookies in a box. Or putting my take out food in a bag. Why should I pay 20 percent added on top because their manager doesn’t want to pay them and instead puts the expectation on me the customer.
Like, I get it for if you are serving me food, refilling my drinks etc, but these people need to get real.
Then stop going places that expect tips and go to places that don’t. There is a growing movement in hospitality to just charge 20% instead of leaning on social pressure. Go give them your money.
If you don’t want to tip, stop giving money to places that expect tips. Otherwise you’re just reinforcing the system and hurting the person who is serving you exclusively. If you go to those places, then tip. It’s not difficult.
I don’t think a lot of these places “expect” tips. It’s just that they’re all using the same e-commerce kiosks now, and it’s a standard thing with a tipping screen everywhere you go.
I’m a generous tipper when it comes to bars, restaurants, or food delivery, but if it’s something that nobody tipped for 5 years ago, I ain’t tipping for it now just because there’s a kiosk in my face.
I could do that, or I could just keep hitting “No tip” when I know they literally did nothing but hand me the thing I ordered across a counter.
For the sake of argument I could boldly reach across the counter, grab my order and walk out. Would that be cheating the clerk out of money? If that interaction is required and it costs money I’d be the one that felt cheated. That’s in the realm of Ticketmaster convenience fees
What do you mean charge 20%? How sure is the consumer to be that that 20% goes to the employees?
Are they just tacking on 20% because they realize they can get that extra fee for no reason? It’s bullshit and predatory. People are looking at prices to judge where they want to/can afford to eat at and this behavior makes the business look cheaper at first glance.
No, fuck that shit. No tipping and no “service fee” bullshit. Just give us normal, straight prices on the menu. If you cannot afford to pay your staff at the prices for the meals, raise the prices.
I’ve seen places that even write on the menu “to pay our employees a living wage” or similar to justify the fee. Which again, is fucking bullshit! A businesses inability to price its product is no reason for me to deal with fees.
My point is that if someone leaves a 20% tip, that goes to the server and whoever they need to tip out like bartender and busboys. But it goes directly to them. When a business implements a service fee, that direct line to the service worker goes away. If I’m told there is a 20% fee to pay staff, I expect it to go directly to staff.
I’m all for dropping tips and paying living wages. But a “service fee” isn’t the way to do it. Just raise the damn prices.
A mandatory 20% fee is just the business saying that everyone has to tip 20%, and trust us that it actually goes to the servers/staff. There is functionally no difference culture-wise between giving consumers the choice to tip 20% and mandating a 20% service fee. It’s the same as the “gratuity added to parties over 8.”
I think you are over thinking this. The entire point is to drop the 20% tip and to just incorporate the cost and pay everybody a living wage. There’s no calculation to be made about who gets what % or whatever. It doesn’t matter what percentage of your dollar goes to who. It’s about making it like a normal business and getting rid of tip culture all together all together.
Yeah but it’s not like I can easily go to places that don’t require tips though. It can often cost more to go to a place that doesn’t tip than the value of the tip.
So you actually like the tipping system because it allows you to get a meal cheaper at the expense of the person who just served you? Because the way you say this it doesn’t seem like you actually want tipping to go away since it’d make your meals more expensive.
Yeah, people thinking they can end tipping culture on an individual basis are lying to either us or themselves. It’s like thinking your personal commitment to recycling is going to fix climate change. Tipping sucks but the fix is going to have to be systemic, through legislation almost certainly. When you individually refuse to tip you aren’t hurting the culture or the business, just the individual who provided you a service.
I agree with that. If you go to a tipping restaurant and just don’t tip you aren’t actually attacking the culture because A) The culture is driven top down by the business. and B) The business isn’t running on tips. When you pay the bill minus a tip, the business still got every dime they were intending to. They have no incentive to change.
So even if you don’t agree with me that this is a systemic issue that requires a systemic solution, you have to not give tipping businesses money at all if you want to even have a hope of making an impact on an individual level.
Oh god here we go with people making the BS argument “I don’t tip to help end tipping culture” or, my personal favorite, “If I don’t tip them they’ll find another job when they don’t make enough money.”
The other side if that is why should I tip you for putting cookies in a box. Or putting my take out food in a bag. Why should I pay 20 percent added on top because their manager doesn’t want to pay them and instead puts the expectation on me the customer.
Like, I get it for if you are serving me food, refilling my drinks etc, but these people need to get real.
Then stop going places that expect tips and go to places that don’t. There is a growing movement in hospitality to just charge 20% instead of leaning on social pressure. Go give them your money.
If you don’t want to tip, stop giving money to places that expect tips. Otherwise you’re just reinforcing the system and hurting the person who is serving you exclusively. If you go to those places, then tip. It’s not difficult.
I don’t think a lot of these places “expect” tips. It’s just that they’re all using the same e-commerce kiosks now, and it’s a standard thing with a tipping screen everywhere you go.
I’m a generous tipper when it comes to bars, restaurants, or food delivery, but if it’s something that nobody tipped for 5 years ago, I ain’t tipping for it now just because there’s a kiosk in my face.
I could do that, or I could just keep hitting “No tip” when I know they literally did nothing but hand me the thing I ordered across a counter.
For the sake of argument I could boldly reach across the counter, grab my order and walk out. Would that be cheating the clerk out of money? If that interaction is required and it costs money I’d be the one that felt cheated. That’s in the realm of Ticketmaster convenience fees
What do you mean charge 20%? How sure is the consumer to be that that 20% goes to the employees?
Are they just tacking on 20% because they realize they can get that extra fee for no reason? It’s bullshit and predatory. People are looking at prices to judge where they want to/can afford to eat at and this behavior makes the business look cheaper at first glance.
No, fuck that shit. No tipping and no “service fee” bullshit. Just give us normal, straight prices on the menu. If you cannot afford to pay your staff at the prices for the meals, raise the prices.
I’ve seen places that even write on the menu “to pay our employees a living wage” or similar to justify the fee. Which again, is fucking bullshit! A businesses inability to price its product is no reason for me to deal with fees.
They pay people a higher, standard wage and drop tips entirely. How do you know what % of anything you buy goes to the person serving you?
My point is that if someone leaves a 20% tip, that goes to the server and whoever they need to tip out like bartender and busboys. But it goes directly to them. When a business implements a service fee, that direct line to the service worker goes away. If I’m told there is a 20% fee to pay staff, I expect it to go directly to staff.
I’m all for dropping tips and paying living wages. But a “service fee” isn’t the way to do it. Just raise the damn prices.
A mandatory 20% fee is just the business saying that everyone has to tip 20%, and trust us that it actually goes to the servers/staff. There is functionally no difference culture-wise between giving consumers the choice to tip 20% and mandating a 20% service fee. It’s the same as the “gratuity added to parties over 8.”
I think you are over thinking this. The entire point is to drop the 20% tip and to just incorporate the cost and pay everybody a living wage. There’s no calculation to be made about who gets what % or whatever. It doesn’t matter what percentage of your dollar goes to who. It’s about making it like a normal business and getting rid of tip culture all together all together.
Yeah but it’s not like I can easily go to places that don’t require tips though. It can often cost more to go to a place that doesn’t tip than the value of the tip.
So you actually like the tipping system because it allows you to get a meal cheaper at the expense of the person who just served you? Because the way you say this it doesn’t seem like you actually want tipping to go away since it’d make your meals more expensive.
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many people making the tips don’t want tipping culture to end. They support it.
There are a variety of opinions in hospitality on the issue. This is not a safe generalization.
You are right. It is like any generalization. I’ll go edit it.
Yeah, people thinking they can end tipping culture on an individual basis are lying to either us or themselves. It’s like thinking your personal commitment to recycling is going to fix climate change. Tipping sucks but the fix is going to have to be systemic, through legislation almost certainly. When you individually refuse to tip you aren’t hurting the culture or the business, just the individual who provided you a service.
How about if you just don’t go eat there? You aren’t supporting tipping culture and you’re saving money. Win win.
I agree with that. If you go to a tipping restaurant and just don’t tip you aren’t actually attacking the culture because A) The culture is driven top down by the business. and B) The business isn’t running on tips. When you pay the bill minus a tip, the business still got every dime they were intending to. They have no incentive to change.
So even if you don’t agree with me that this is a systemic issue that requires a systemic solution, you have to not give tipping businesses money at all if you want to even have a hope of making an impact on an individual level.